Star Wars (movie spoilers itt)

[grue]

Okay this is a Star Wars thread.

I had never watched SW before. Not for lack of opportunity, but for lack of interest - I was never much of a scifi guy, and not much of a movie guy, and those two combined kinda kept me out of the loop.

Mind you I was always vaguely aware of the story - not as much as I thought that I was, but I knew the gist of it.

Boiling down, here is the summarized opinion on the whole Star Wars movies by a 30 year-old guy who broke his SW virginity:

The trilogy is great. Kinda awkward - in many places it fumbles with the pacing and the scenes are a bit bruteforced. Which is saying something considering how long the film it is, and it does speak to the story density. Some things about episode 4 scream "outdated" - everyone is white and male, which is weird nowadays, not even a token black man to be seen. Also, the One Hot Chick in the galaxy who is Not Like The Other Girls. And Single, though surrounded by millions of men. That trope is older than moses' piss. Of course I was mindful of the movie's time, but it does speak a lot of how certain things didn't really age well.

The discomfort aside, it's great. Leia quickly grows out of her token hot chick role and is an awesome character in her own right. The movie is ominous and simple, the characters are also simplistic but in a way that's appealling. It has a lot of clichés done right, and I'm on board for that certainly, nothing wrong with clichés if they're well executed. The movie's grittiness and clumsyness add to the charm after a while, and play up to the trilogy's favour, because they kinda pin the fantasy elements of the film to the ground. It gives it humanity, I guess.

As for the prequels...

Well, everyone knows and I knew beforehand that the prequels were bad. Awful, even. I guess that I had such a predisposition to expect a very bad movie (a la Pacific Rim) that, really, I didn't think episode 1 was that bad. Bunch of plot holes, scenes that drag, obvious lack of content - and the disparity isn't lost on me, the contrast between the high-paced, force-jammed story elements of the original trilogy and the long drags of the prequels, to me show a bit of a loss in focus. Episode 2 was a nightmare, and to me it was the low point of the prequels, even considering how laughable the last third of episode 3 was. I rate episode 2 a Pacific Rim/10, whereas episodes 1 and 3 have some 2 and 3 moments, but overall I'll grant them a 4.5/10.

Finally, onwards to chapter VII.

There's not much to say about that one. I mean, it's a rehash of episodes 4 and 5. There are some things that I get, some others that I didn't and like I discussed with Ben before, I don't really feel Kylo's struggle. Like, I can't take his "light side" seriously. But it was all so samey that there isn't much to say about the story, we'll see how it picks up from here. Movie-wise, it certainly learned from the many mistakes in the prequels and thank god they dropped that miti-chlorians nonsense.

There are many aspects to discuss about the movie but this OP is way too large already so if anyone wants to jump in, let's talk Star Wars.

[Tempest]

i really enjoyed episode 7 but i feel like JJ Abrams was juuuust a bit too heavy handed on the 'wow look it's a reference to the original movies!!' even outside of it just following almost the same story beats. when han solo and kylo ren have their face-off on the tiny bridge above the huge pit i physically cringed at how fucking 'check out this reference xD' it was. almost identical in every way to vader and luke's confrontation below cloud city.

overall though i thought it was really nice and it did a very good job at being a totally neutral jump-off point; you can go into it without having seen any of the 6 previous movies and not really be that lost because it's pretty self-contained.

[Tempest]

also while i'm talking about it i found the prequels to be a lot less offensive than most other people tbh. i thought most of the storyline stuff was fine, the movies themselves were just a mess of CGI for the most part

i say that i thought most of the storyline stuff was fine, obviously this is barring the fact that episode 1 is mostly stuff that they decided to retcon like midichlorians and shit. i'm not sure what was running through george lucas' head, he just decided that it was a dumb idea for little micro organisms living in your blood to dictate your force powers. and thank god. it took this cool sort of mysterious thing (either ur born with force sensitivity or fuck you) and literally turned it into some kind of weird science thing.

[grue]

Yeah it seems clear that they want it to be a jump-off point, even if just because Disney put a LOT of money into buying this franchise and it has to pay off for many years to come otherwise it's just stupid. I get starting it from a familiar point, and mirroring episodes 4 and 5, but I agree that they overdid it. "Ooooh there's c3po and r2d2!!! Hu huuuu" didn't really cut it for me - look, I get it, people want more of that dumb robot, but frankly I don't. I don't see the need for them to cameo other than the lame nod at the sreeching fanbase.

Though I was curiosu as to why c3po has a red arm? A book reason maybe? Weird.

Honestly though the bridge scene... I kinda liked it. Because the film is going off on such a familiar tone, and that scene is an evident departure of "New Star Wars" from the old. Vader was a good guy corrupted by the dark side who redempts by failing to kill his son and offing Darth Sidius. Kylo is a bad guy who is being corrupted by the light side and he kills off his father to deny that corruption. It's a clear divergence from Vader, and that's the film setting off into a whole new direction. Even if it is by hammering the point that the scenes were meant to be similar.

[Tempest]

i do like that kylo ren killed his father, tbh, because it really solidifies that he is a BAD GUY!!!! and takes away any real chance for redemption... of course, they could still try to have him "redeemed" in the later movies, which holy shit please no. you've set up this guy to be an actual bad guy, to be irredeemable. don't fuck this up.

of course, Abrams isn't directing the next movies, which could be a blessing or a curse. it's REALLY weird to me that they decided for no real reason to do a different director for each movie; it could be a disaster. it seems weirdly unnecessary; directing a star wars movie was JJ Abrams' dream, I'm certain he would be easy enough to keep on for the remaining 2, probably for a pretty low pay too. why take the risk of the movies having absolutely no cohesion?

edit: yeah i think the red arm is a book reason that will be expounded upon later in the movies, i googled it when i saw it and there was a short explanation of what happened presumably from some ancillary material. i feel like it's weird that they didn't make the first movie longer to be able to clear up a few of these weird plotholes: it wasn't even that long for a star wars movie

[grue]

I wouldn't know that was the case. Three directors? Bold move.

[Tempest]

yeah, Rian Johnson is directing episode 8 which is cool because he directed Looper and I thought that movie was rad

Colin Trevorrow is directing episode 9 which i am less optimistic about because Jurassic World was okay but it was kind of boring in terms of how it was directed and how it progressed.

both of them have pretty sparse directing credits though, which is also weird to me

[Ben]

the original trilogy had three directors: lucas, irvin kershner (who also directed robocop 2), and richard marquand


the prequels are bad not just because of weird details but because they lack simplicity and heart. they are no longer basic and archetypal, they are weird and crazed and not well thought out.

TFA, i liked pretty much every new thing about it. the issue was just that, that was only 15% of the movie. my favorite of the originals is empire, of course

[Tempest]

the original trilogy did indeed have three directors, but there's no doubt in my mind that that whole effort was orchestrated almost entirely by george lucas. he had his grubby mitts in all 3 of those movies, so despite the fact that he did not direct the last 2 i'm certain he dictated how they went.

[Ben]

i think george had a lot to say but the other dudes are under appreciated. if youre curious what a 100% george lucas production looks like, you have the prequels